Thomas Paine Says:
September 28, 2010 at 4:54 pm | Reply edit
Silly, silly Packer fans. So much stupidity posted here…where to begin.
Yes, Forte did fumble. But it was recovered by the Bears. Moot point other than maybe a couple of yards one way or the other.
The Burnett play was absolutely pass interference. Bennett was trying to make a play on the ball – Burnett was not. Watch the replay – Bennett stopped at about the 12 to position himself to try to catch the ball. Burnett made contact with him and drove him back to the 8. Moving the receiver 4 yards is not having “position”. It is illegal contact, which if the ball is in the air, is called pass interference. There is no debating that. Not to mention Burnett grabbed Bennett’s arms (note the plural, as in BOTH arms). There is no question it was pass interference, and to argue otherwise either proves your complete lack of objectivity, or your ignorance about the game. Or both.
And the idiot who is suggesting the game was fixed because of the disparity in penalties is just foolish. The Packers played horribly. The majority of the penalties came from the offensive line which was clearly out-matched by the faster Bear defenders. Not a conspiracy, just proof that the might Pack isn’t what you thought they were. Sure there were some bad calls. But there are in every game. Bad calls against the Bears too – that roughing the passer call on Melton was very weak and changed the entire drive. And that non-tackle of Kuhns – while corrected by replay — that was about the worst call I’ve ever seen.
But the real point I want to make is this. The Packers are grossly over-rated, and to think that the Bears robbed them is missing what really happened. The Packers have a great passing offense, which looks nice on SportsCenter, but that alone doesn’t make them a great team. Their offensive line is terrible. Secondary, terrible (but with potential). Running game, terrible. Special teams, terrible. Team discipline, terrible. Head coaching, terrible. Even the ‘great’ defense isn’t physically dominant and relies heavily on confusion to succeed, and that can be contained by a well coached team. The majority of the penalties from last night were because the Packers couldn’t match up on a talent basis, and the only chance they had was to ‘cheat’. Yes, the Bears did get a bit lucky but that is the case in every close game — the bounce of a ball, call of an official, slip of a defender, etc. Very good chance the Packers win in Lambeau in January, but that doesn’t mean they were the better team last night. They played foolishly and exposed several weaknesses, and got beat. Not by the refs, but by the Bears. So stop the whining.
MY RESPONSE:
Paine – such arrogance.
1) I’m not sure the Bears recovered the Forte fumble. But even if this is the one thing you’re right about, whether or not they recovered it is a “moot” point” itself because the whistle blew the play dead while the play was still going on. It’s possible the Packers could have recovered it if the play hadn’t been blown dead – that’s why they don’t allow challenges of such plays. Of course, on the first Nick Collins pick on the last drive, the whistle wasn’t blown until the officials saw that the Packers recovered Collins’ fumble.
2) I’ve watched the Burnett replay several times. Burnett went up with Bennett, Burnett was facing the QB more than Bennett, they bumped into each other both going for the ball (incidental contact) and then Collins picked off the pass that Bennett couldn’t have caught anyway. I’m willing to listen to other opinions on the play certainly and can admit it was at least close, but your assertion that we all must not know anything about football if we don’t see it your totally biased way is absurd. Charles Woodson, a credible elder statesman in the NFL made it a specific point in an interview last night to criticize that particular call. And he knows football…
3) The Packers are a good team – not ‘terrible’ in every facet except pass offense as you indicate. That’s just plain inaccurate. We didn’t play well last night, committed some dumb penalties, made boneheaded errors – yes. And we barely lost to a team that was overjoyed to beat a team they knew was better.
4) That Melton play was no different than the play our Frank Zombo made a few series later – that also helped sustain a drive for the Bears. I happen to think both were poor calls – either way, you try to point out how the officiating was just bad all around, but then give an example of a play that was immediately offset by the same bad call against the Packers.
5) Your assertion that the Packers had to “cheat” because they couldn’t match-up on a talent-basis is ridiculous. The Bears are not a more talented team. Period. They were lucky to win the game last night and lucky to beat Detroit in Week 1.
READERS – YOUR RESPONSE?
packergeeks 
September 28, 2010 at 6:10 pm |
Good officiating can mean several things…Normally it means if a game is being called tight, the officials call it tight for both teams (ie holding…) conversely if they are “letting them play” then they let play with minimal stoppages. My opinion is that in last nights game the officials were calling the packers incredibly tight while letting most fouls committed by the Bears slide. May or may not be true but thats just how it looked. Aggressive games are rarely only played by one side.
Mr. Paines’ comments were mostly directed at my comment in the “A FEW POINTS” post….No one was saying that the game was in fact fixed, just strange how it played out.
September 28, 2010 at 6:50 pm |
Apparently, allowing Forte only 29 yards is not playing physical…
The other funny argument is that OUR offensive line is terrible… wow
But there is really no point even debating anything a bear fan troll says. He obviously knows little of what he is talking about.
One thing that I find unbelievable is that no one other than Packer bloggers is talking about the first Collins interception on the last drive. I have been watching ESPN and NFLN and not even a single mention or highlight of it.
September 28, 2010 at 6:55 pm |
word A Rodg – haven’t seen or heard anyone else talk about it. only thing I’ve heard is talk about a dropped interception by Collins. I’ll admit that when I watched the replay, there was a player in the way of the play for a moment. But it still looked pretty clear to me that he had the ball for 3 steps and then fumbled it away.
September 28, 2010 at 7:05 pm |
one more thing…not sure if anyone noticed this but the betting line for next weeks CHI vs NYG game opened with the Bears as a 4 point UNDERDOG!!!! Against the struggling and piss poor giants? Not even Vegas believes that the Bears are that great hahaha… One would think that a 3-0 team would at least be a slight favorite against this years Giants…
If you gamble on pro sports (or at least observe it) one begins to realize that for the most part Vegas really knows whats up when it comes to spreads. Its amazing how many spreads are hit right on the head (hence teams be 3.5 pt favorites and eliminating the chances of a push)
thought this was interesting…
September 28, 2010 at 7:19 pm |
Well put Mr. Paine, which is exactly what the Bears caused last evening.
But you are clearly not an “Angry Bears Fan”, only a realist.
September 28, 2010 at 9:32 pm |
It’s amazing that these arrogant Packer fans think they can analyze a football game any better than one who is not. There was no conspracy by the refs. The Packers were responsible for all of the penalties called against them. I know it makes you feel better to think otherwise. What we learned about the Packers last might is that they are an average team at best.
September 28, 2010 at 9:46 pm |
Remember week one where the Bears lost to the Lions? Oh yeah, I forgot, the refs gave them that one too… 3-0 and the bears are the best team in the league yet still somehow 4 pt underdogs next week
It’s a long season
September 29, 2010 at 1:58 am
Nice burn!!
September 29, 2010 at 10:50 am |
I am not going to get into the specifics of the game and each penalty but the reality is this:
The Bears did not beat the Packers. Neither did the refs. The Packers imploded and the Bears happened to be there when it happened. That’s what happened on Monday. Nothing more; nothing less. Via our penalties we gave the Bears 158 yards and nullified two interceptions and a touchdown. With all of this help, the Bears barely won the game. That is not a good team. Period.
September 29, 2010 at 1:11 pm |
Angry? Why would any Bear fan be angry this week (other than that turd who got into it with Collins)? No, just someone with a clear perspective who felt like injecting a dose of Common Sense into your little Packer party.
The whole point of my commentary was to state the Packer fans are being ridiculous with their refusal to accept reality. On my side, I can look at the Bears and realize that despite having the best record in the conference, that they are maybe a wild-card caliber team at best. I hope for more, and am thrilled with what I’ve gotten so far, but I recognize there are issues that will prevent the team from going very far (o-line, secondary, questionable QB play, etc). Unfortunately the Packer fans are a bit too drunk on their green and gold Kool-Aid to do the same with their team. Sure, they were the pre-season favorite of many national “experts”. But so were the Vikings and Cowboys — would anyone reading this not say that the Vikes or Cowboys were over-rated? Of course not. But you cannot look in the mirror and see the same with your own team. The Packers are good but not great. In all honesty, I’d say they are better overall than the Bears and will still likely win the division. But they are definitely susceptible and flawed, and it was the Bears that beat them on Monday night (not the refs, and not the Packers).
Addressing a few of the responses:
– yes, the offensive line is terrible. Led the league in sacks last year and the tackles are even older this year. Even Jon Gruden commented about it, and for him to say anything negative about anyone — that is significant.
– I didn’t say the Packers are terrible at everything. Just o-line, secondary, rushing, special teams and coaching. You still have your passing offense and rush defense. And I think secondary will improve as the rookies get more experience. And again, I’m not saying the Bears are better.
– The comments I read by Woodson were more about how that play is always called in the offense’s favor, not so much on the Bennett-Burnett play specifically (although he may have had other comments beyond what I read on espn.com). Perhaps the rule is wrong – but the way it is written that WAS clearly interference. I guarantee if it was as bad as the Packer fans are saying, there would be an uproar around the league like with the Calvin Johnson play in week 1. Instead, hard to even find a mention of it anywhere but Packer sites (which is how I found your site in the first place). I found one small post on espn, and it said the call was correct.
– there is a reason no one but Packer fans are discussing the “first Collins interception”. He didn’t hang on to it. Seemed pretty clear once ESPN showed the replay from the endzone angle. And I’m pretty sure it was within 2 minutes so would have been reviewed if even close (although don’t quote me on the 2 minutes part)
– If you honestly think the Packers’ “implosion” had nothing to do with the Bears, you’re just not paying attention. Most of the penalties were from the o-line trying to handle Peppers. You can’t say the Bears had nothing to do with it.
And one more point. Lot of comments (here and elsewhere) from Packer fans about how the Bears were lucky to win in week 1. I’ll concede that Calvin Johnson call at the end was a crock. But the Bears dominated the game in yards and time of possession, and the only reason the Lions were even in a position to win was the Bears many costly mental mistakes. Does that sound familiar? Certainly seems hypocritical to say the Bears deserved to lose that game despite dominating, but the Packers deserved to win this game because they dominated. My opinion – Bears were lucky to win week 1, deserved to win week 3. But if you feel the opposite that’s your prerogative. But you can’t have it both ways – either Team A dominated and deserved to win, or Team B hung around and took advantage when the opportunity presented itself. Not both.
September 29, 2010 at 11:25 pm |
Ah, Mr. Paine, legend has the Cowboys as America’s Team. The Plaine Truth is that Packerfans believe their guys are God’s Team endowed with the requisite deified rights. They were not supposed to lose a game in 2010. To arrive unscathed at the pinnacle. To raise the trophy in Texas. You must be understanding of their agony, chagrin and outrage that their team bowed unceremoniously to the Bears and played like lumpkins in the national spotlight and must conjure up all manner of conspiracies to explain the event. The word hubris comes to mind.
Btw, I’ve visited your lovely cottage many times..and your monument. Um..er..I do hope that your brain is in fact where it’s supposed to be.
September 29, 2010 at 3:45 pm |
TP – Nice Common Sense reference – but you’re not coming at us with much Common Sense when you state that the Packers are “grossly overrated” and that Packer fans are being “ridiculous for their refusal to accept reality”. Last year, we went to the playoffs, barely lost a tough game on the road, had one of the top QBs in the NFL, had an explosive offense and had a defense that either led the NFL or was in the top 5 in key areas. And this year, we haven’t even played that well so far, yet we’ve beaten Philly on the road, crushed Buffalo and only lost to your Bears…on the road. I think the expectations many Packer fans (and others) have this year are in line with both the positive experience of the team last year and the fact that many of the positive factors that contributed to that success remain in place.
September 29, 2010 at 7:34 pm |
I agree completly TP. The packer fans are not capable at looking at that game objectivly.
September 30, 2010 at 8:54 pm |
Geez, Da Bears won. 18 penalties–McMuffin needs to fix this but can’t. Been going on way too long. How many years have the Pack been one of the most penalized teams? Thought this was fixed after the 1st 2 weeks. Get into a BIG game and what happens? Implosion. There is a pattern here.
Where is that “high powered” offense? MM blows big games. Period.
Please do not lose to Detroit next week. PLEASE.
TP & Bearsfan–wouldn’t gloat too loudly boys. It’s only week 3.
January 3, 2011 at 2:14 pm |
The Packer Pukes are just pissed off that it was the Bears that knocked out Favre once and for all. They had relished the opportunity to see him knocked silly, laying on the turf of Lambeau Field, under the weight of one of their fat assed nose tackles, while the Packer Pukes screamed for blood.